Suggestion: Fuel Tank Materials Customization Options

@yopo Great! :D

@AnotherFireFox Sure, I don't have a lot of free time anymore due to volunteering to help with the SARS-CoV-2 pandemic, but when I get some downtime I'd be happy to make a mod with you! My skills include graphic design, scripting, and programming with Python 3.7 and Fortran-90. I don't know if those skills are helpful for this type of mod, but I'll be happy to at least give it a shot! :)

Can you work with me to make this real?

@DPSAircraftManufacturer I'll try and upload my super-heavy rockets online so you can download them from a link, thanks!

@yopo ok :) I hope I can find a fix

@pedro16797 Pedro, thanks I'll link two multi-stage rocket designs of mine, one that functions properly, and one that explodes on the launchpad every time (it's slightly larger and has more stages/engines). I'll post the link here when I get a chance. :)

@AndrewGarrison

@yopo can you share the craft (unlisted if you don't want to publish it yet) and then send me the link?

@pedro16797 Thanks for the information, pedro! So, I've tested out adding an interstage at the very bottom of my rockets to cover the first stage's engines, I've also tested out various pre-launch rocket-holding clamps made of struts, smaller fuel tanks, and detachers. Yet, my multi-stage rockets with large fuel tanks for each stage (from 4-to-6 stages total) with each fuel tank carrying 6 or more engines under it (attached with fuel adapters), continue to explode. It's always the fuel tanks themselves that explode and always the first stage, followed by the collapse and explosion of the rest of the rocket from bottom-to-top. To me, this at first seemed like some parts were accidentally detached in the designer, but I tested this idea by painstakingly re-attaching every single part of my rocket and verifying the proper staging sequence 100%. I left no stone unturned, and again the first stages just can't stop exploding. I've even scrapped all of my former designs and built entirely new rockets in the latest public game version 0.7.x, starting simple and working my way up to larger multi-stage rockets. There is some "magic" threshold of fuel-tank size, number of stages, and number of attached rocket engines (any type), where any design larger/more-complex and its first stages are guaranteed to explode. This has all led me to form the hypothesis that the game somehow simulates structural integrity already, and that too much fuel-mass for a given size (area and volume) of fuel tank, with more than one-stage, results in the fuel tanks collapsing and then exploding, and since it's always the first stage that collapses followed by the upper-stages, there seem to be hard limits on the mass-size ratio of fuel tanks in this game. It's either that or there's some bug causing engines to fall off or some sort of part clipping when rockets reach a certain size and number of stages. Because all of my large rocket designs used to work prior to version 0.7 without any support structures, struts, ground-level interstage. So, do you think that the fuel tanks are collapsing due to structural integrity limits? Or, do you think the fuel adapters are breaking due to their load-bearing limits (I like to use multiple, very large engines connected to fuel tanks with adapters)? I've even tried "cheating" by reducing the total mass of the fully-fueled tanks, engines, etc.. as well as increasing stability values in the tweaking options per-part. Thanks! Just trying to get to the bottom of this issue, your help is appreciated. :)

@yopo Hm, you should be able to prevent your rocket from collapse if you add a interstage at the bottom. Now attachment points have rigidity and parts hold a certain amount of force (that's because heavier crafts tend to break easier if you don't have any support)
The integrity idea is based on degradation with use (more if you force the parts over their limits) and randomization

@pedro16797 Oh that's interesting, I was under the impression that the game already included structural integrity simulation. I've noticed that making a rocket's fuel tank too large and filling it with 100% fuel, making its ratio of mass : volume ratio too high, will cause the first/lower stage structures to break and explode first on the launchpad, followed by the upper stages falling to the ground and also exploding. So, I discovered the only way to avoid structural collapse of my very heavy rockets was to build my rocket using a greater number of smaller-volume fuel tanks for each stage. So, my suggestion was based on this in-game observation, since I thought that a good solution to large fuel tanks collapsing and exploding under too much load-bearing stress would be to give players the option to make their fuel tanks out of stronger/lighter materials (e.g. metal composites or carbon fiber). As it would reduce total rocket mass and allow for carrying more fuel, extending range, and require fewer parts, which would decrease complexity while speeding up simulation frame-rate. If the game doesn't, or never will, include structural integrity simulation then there is no point in having stronger materials since the standard fuel tanks we have now would be infinitely strong. But, that's not been my experience so far with the game, thanks.

@yopo The thing is that this may add too much complexity for the average user
For the campaign mode I would love to see a hardcore mode where parts have integrity and you have to test them to see the integrity they have. Where parts cant fail if you don't test them and you can reuse the vehicles but if you don't test them enough it may have a failure

@pedro16797 Oh, thanks for the information, I didn't know "Complex Rockets" was the name of your modding group, so I interpreted what Kell said as "my suggestion was too complex" to be in Simple Rockets 2. Anyhow, I'd love to see my suggestion of new fuel tank materials options and or structural integrity sliders in a mod or the game, but wouldn't you prefer to see custom fuel tank materials/structural integrity included as a native feature programmed into the game itself? It would certainly make it easier on your modding group in the future as it would be one less mod to create.

Basically I want The Children of a Dead Earth level complexity

@yopo it's just that @AnotherFireFox wants to explore the possibility of making a mod about this, but we have to wait until the devs release the mod tools
And I answered @Kell because he said ComplexRockets, and that's the name of our modding group

@pedro16797 Pedro, can you elaborate? Thanks. :)

@yopo sorry, @Kell is right

@AnotherFireFox @yopo

@Kell AFF wants to make a mod about this, but we have to wait until mod tools are released

@KraZIvan Oh, I thought I did post this in the suggestion area, perhaps a moderator can move it? And thanks for supporting my idea! :)

I disagree that this would make the game too complex. We already have procedural rocket engines and jet engines which arguably make this game no longer simple, and that's even before full release.

I think having struts and fuselages of different materials is a great idea and it wouldn't be too hard to implement, however the number of materials suggested above might be a bit too much. To keep things simple, put a material-type selection menu in the build panel, and it would let you chose between 2 or 3 materials. 2 or 3 materials per structural part is still simple.
@yopo why don't you post this in the suggestion area?

@Kell Indeed, my suggestion would add more complexity to Simple Rockets, however, with the amount of customization that's now possible with the procedural rocket engines I feel that adding some slight customization of fuel tank materials wouldn't be so complex that it would confuse anyone, and from a development standpoint it would involve adding a slider or two in the current component-options menu in the designer UI (not saying that's easy, but it doesn't seem to be a huge task from my perspective as a programmer). And yes, unfortunately, my multi-stage rockets (any rocket >3 stages with wide fuel tanks) are breaking before engine-start on the launchpad even with launch clamps connected, even with six launch clamps made from beefed up struts and side-detachers.

ComplexRockets.

With that aside, this happens even with the launch clamps in place?